2012-11-07 Minutes
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Roll Call
Board Members
This meeting was quorate
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Full Minutes
| Time | Name | Minute |
|---|---|---|
| 20:02 | Nachimir | Nottinghack members meeting about to start, November 7th 2012. |
| 20:05 | kimjonggill joined the chat room. | |
| 20:06 | Nachimir | Roll call: James H., David H, Craig P, Daniel, Andrew A, Kate B, Russell, Nicola L., Matt Ll, Dominic M, David C., Dan W, Gill Z. (Board: Quorate). |
| 20:06 | Nachimir | Michael W joins. |
| 20:07 | Nachimir | James H apologises for not getting the minutes up on tyhe wiki yet. |
| 20:08 | Nachimir | Item 5. Pledge Drives |
| 20:08 | Nachimir | (James apologises for agenda jumping around a bit). |
| 20:09 | Nachimir | David C: Have spent some money fixing up the wood lathe, would like those expenses repaid. |
| 20:09 | Nachimir | Looking back, we had quite a lot of pledges for a wood lathe. One person who pledged has left the country since. |
| 20:09 | Nachimir | Is is reasonable for pledge drives to be ongoing and open ended, or should they have a target/cut off date? |
| 20:10 | Nachimir | Dominic asks: What's been spent on the wood lathe? David C: About £66, and Wendy has contributed about £100 to chucks etc. |
| 20:11 | Nachimir | Dominic suggests we just pay it out of hackspace funds. |
| 20:11 | Nachimir | (Michael E. joins) |
| 20:12 | Nachimir | Votes against: 0. |
| 20:12 | Nachimir | Expenses for David C, carried. Action: DM to talk to Wendy about her contributions. |
| 20:13 | Nachimir | David C and James ask the original question again: Should pledge drives have an open end, or a target/cutoff? |
| 20:13 | Nachimir | Matt Ll: sometimes, we look around ebay for months to get something, and I don't think the hackspace should sit on people's money. |
| 20:13 | Nachimir | Andrew A suggests something like kickstarter. |
| 20:14 | Nachimir | James H: I don't see sitting on people's money as necessarily a bad thing, if we set up a separate account for it. |
| 20:14 | Nachimir | Micheal E: Why don't we try a few different things and see what works? |
| 20:14 | Nachimir | (some discussion of cutoff), suggested: 6 months. |
| 20:15 | Nachimir | Michael W: [Has to be case by case, some things are bigger and more difficult to get |
| 20:15 | Nachimir | Matt Ll: Andrew T planning on putting a pledge system into HMS. |
| 20:16 | Nachimir | James H: The wood lathe thread raised more than we've spent on the wood lathe. |
| 20:16 | Nachimir | Messaging has to be careful if we resurrect the thread: People shouldn't feel obliged to honour their pledges given they're that old. |
| 20:17 | Nachimir | Action: David C to message list regarding wood lathe. |
| 20:18 | Nachimir | David H: Integration with HMX would be good thing: Can be added to people's bills if a pledge hits target, and people will know they can't pledge lightly. |
| 20:18 | Nachimir | *HMS |
| 20:19 | Nachimir | David C mentions pillar drill pledge. Russell mentions we shouldn't go to machine mart, as newer machines are badly constructed. Something older and reconditioned would probably be better for our money. |
| 20:20 | Nachimir | [Discussion |
| 20:21 | Nachimir | Action: DM to find out how much we have pledged for a pillar drill. |
| 20:21 | Nachimir | (Mouse joins). |
| 20:22 | Nachimir | Action: DM and Russell to assess options for pillar drills. |
| 20:22 | Nachimir | James says: "Putting the 3 phase back in is a 10 minute job". |
| 20:22 | Nachimir | Item 2: Actions update. |
| 20:22 | Nachimir | Chairs back, DM: All chairs are at the popup shop until it closes. |
| 20:23 | Nachimir | Video: Nothing sorted beyond the conversation me and Jake had at the time. Action: David H to check. |
| 20:24 | Nachimir | Quotes for stickers and cleaners, DM: Not done it. Actions, ongoing. |
| 20:25 | Nachimir | Hack the space cancelled this month due to power out. Next month: 2nd December, list in events: Action for Kate B. |
| 20:25 | Nachimir | Cost shelves to replace blue racking: Matt Ll. Ongoing Action. |
| 20:26 | Nachimir | Hazard analysis matrix on blue room table, Michael E.: Yep. |
| 20:26 | Nachimir | Get rid of brown chairs: Not yet, but will. Action, David C. |
| 20:27 | Nachimir | Need someone to take on and produce risk assessments for the space: Who? Michael E: Whoever on the mailing list said we needed them. James: Happy to hunt them down. |
| 20:28 | Nachimir | Dominic: Since no one is volunteering, should we pay someone to come in and do some? |
| 20:28 | Nachimir | Andrew A: How much would it cost? |
| 20:28 | Nachimir | DM: Don't know. |
| 20:28 | Nachimir | Kate: Happy for someone to be paid to do it. |
| 20:28 | Nachimir | Dominic: Action, look into getting someone to do risk assessments. |
| 20:30 | Nachimir | [discussion of insurance |
| 20:31 | Nachimir | Kate: Action: I'll do the quote for stickers if Dominic lets me know what's needed. |
| 20:31 | Nachimir | Item 4: Young Hackers Members. |
| 20:31 | Nachimir | James H: We've had a number of enquiries from children, 16 - 18, about membership. At the moment, rule is that their parents become members and they come with supervision. |
| 20:32 | Nachimir | I'd like to open up to 16 - 18 as young hackers. |
| 20:32 | Nachimir | Dominic: I'm for it, member with full access, and no supervision, though on a case by case basis. Possibly in the form of some agreement with their legal guardian. |
| 20:33 | Nachimir | James: Would be exactly the same as a normal membership, but we'd insist on parent or guardian coming with them to see the space and understand, and signing an agreement that says we are not responsible beyond our ordinary duty of care for those children. |
| 20:34 | Nachimir | Michael W: Some 16 year olds can be emancipated. Can marry, legally leave care. |
| 20:34 | Nachimir | Mouse: Sometimes, we have alcohol in the space, I wouldn't want that to be banned as a result. |
| 20:35 | Nachimir | Michael W: Only thing in law is that you can't sell it to them. |
| 20:35 | Nachimir | Kate: Wouldn't want to end up in press as "hackspace gets kids drunk". Mouse: I wouldn't want people to feel awkward about drinking at social events. |
| 20:36 | Nachimir | James: Suggested option of time limited entry to the space. Personally, not necessarily for that, but wanted to bring it up as something that had been discussed. |
| 20:37 | Nachimir | Dominic: We're not saying these thing will happen, but want to show we've thought about and addressed them. |
| 20:37 | Nachimir | James: Would like to get proper legal advice. Dominic: Fine, get a quote (Action, Jame H.) |
| 20:37 | Nachimir | Kate, yes, would like proper legal advice. |
| 20:38 | Nachimir | Don't worry so much about reputational damage, but someone's mother coming here and screaming at us because little Johnny had a beer. We should be able to show that we';ve thought of and planned for this kind of thing. |
| 20:38 | Nachimir | James: Legal advice before anything else. |
| 20:40 | LWK_mac joined the chat room. | |
| 20:40 | Nachimir | Andrew A: At the national museum of computing, we have young members, but they're vetted because we have to look after them. |
| 20:40 | Nachimir | James: I do't want to have to look after them. If the legal advice states we have to look after under 18s, then I'll be against it. We can't be in loco parentis for anybody. |
| 20:41 | Nachimir | Michael W: I used to do a lot of rocketry, and we didn't let children handle any high power rocket motors until they'd sat an exam. So did adults, but we made it tougher for kids, and introduced it at a lower power, to make sure they understood basic safety rules. |
| 20:42 | Nachimir | Dan W: Suggestion on legal advice. Possibly, we could get some advice from Nottingham Trent University. |
| 20:43 | Nachimir | Action: David H to talk to NTU marketing. Dominic: Would rather pay a lawyer. |
| 20:43 | Nachimir | Item 3, financial update. |
| 20:43 | LWK_mac | ==Quick summary== |
| 20:43 | LWK_mac | Start bank balance: £3511.08 |
| 20:44 | LWK_mac | Out: £1616.09 |
| 20:44 | LWK_mac | In: £1775.29 |
| 20:44 | LWK_mac | End: £3670.28 |
| 20:44 | LWK_mac | Paypal Start: £43.76 |
| 20:44 | LWK_mac | Paypal End: £43.76 |
| 20:44 | LWK_mac | Cash Start balance: £84.02 |
| 20:44 | LWK_mac | Cash In: £568.49 |
| 20:44 | LWK_mac | Cash Out: £180.27 |
| 20:44 | LWK_mac | Cash End: £472.24 |
| 20:44 | LWK_mac | ==Members== |
| 20:44 | LWK_mac | Start: 128 |
| 20:44 | LWK_mac | New: 7 |
| 20:44 | LWK_mac | Ex: 7 |
| 20:44 | LWK_mac | End: 128 |
| 20:44 | LWK_mac | Average membership due: £12.72 |
| 20:44 | LWK_mac | ==In/out Breakdown== |
| 20:44 | LWK_mac | ===Outgoings=== |
| 20:44 | LWK_mac | BizSpace: £1,180.08 |
| 20:44 | LWK_mac | Talk talk: £28.74 |
| 20:44 | LWK_mac | Insurance: £65.39 |
| 20:44 | LWK_mac | Loan: £208.33 |
| 20:44 | LWK_mac | Other: £133.55 |
| 20:44 | LWK_mac | ===Income=== |
| 20:44 | LWK_mac | Membership dues: £1523.29 |
| 20:44 | LWK_mac | Petty Cash Deposits: £207.00 |
| 20:44 | LWK_mac | Workshops: £ |
| 20:44 | LWK_mac | Donations: £ |
| 20:44 | LWK_mac | Events: £ |
| 20:44 | LWK_mac | Pledges: £45 |
| 20:48 | kimjonggill_ joined the chat room. | |
| 20:49 | Nachimir | Kate asks average. Matt Ll: Descending continually. Dominic: We're one of the cheapest spaces to be in at the moment. (General discussion: We need to raise our average). |
| 20:49 | Nachimir | Item 6. Minimum membership? |
| 20:49 | kimjonggill left the chat room. (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) | |
| 20:49 | Nachimir | Item 6: Safety gear. |
| 20:49 | Nachimir | (oops). |
| 20:50 | Nachimir | Mouse has proposed buying more ear defenders for the workshop. JameS: How many do you think we should get? Mouse: 5 or 6 pairs. |
| 20:50 | Nachimir | James: Any objections to authorising @0 - 30 quid for ear defenders? |
| 20:50 | Nachimir | Russell: Are they over ear? |
| 20:50 | Nachimir | Budget £20, authorised. |
| 20:51 | Nachimir | David C raised: We should have some masks for the spray booth. Also, disposable dust masks for the woodworking area. |
| 20:51 | Nachimir | Any objections? None. |
| 20:51 | Nachimir | Action: Matt Ll to sort out. |
| 20:52 | Nachimir | James: David C, do you think we should have a different kind of mask for the spray booth? Russell, yes, has to be a painters mask. |
| 20:52 | Nachimir | Dominic: If it's less than £50, I think we should get it. |
| 20:52 | Nachimir | We need this stuff. |
| 20:53 | Nachimir | Michael W: Carbon filters have a life. Russell: We have a mechanism for dating them when you put them in. |
| 20:54 | Nachimir | Dominic: Proposes that we have a large enough stock of them that we replenish, that we rarely ever worry about them. Want to get to point where we're providing PPE and it's no issue. |
| 20:55 | Nachimir | Item 7: Minimum membership. |
| 20:55 | Nachimir | A few times in past, a minimum membership of a fiver has been mooted. Generally not adopted on basis that fewer rules are better.But soemthing happened that reminded me. |
| 20:55 | Nachimir | Member emailed "I'm not using the space much, but want to keep access. So, I've dropped my monthly payment to a penny. I trust this is the right way to go about things?". |
| 20:56 | Nachimir | Discussed with board and replied: No it's not. Kate pointed out that's about 2 minutes of electricity. Arguable that 24h access alone costs more than a penny per month per member. |
| 20:56 | Nachimir | Craig P: Perhaps we have a minimum for 24h access? |
| 20:56 | Nachimir | James H: Goes back to Mouses question earlier of minimum membership for a box. |
| 20:57 | Nachimir | Dominic: Once we start making rules, we possibly lose a lot of value to people. Looks bureaucratic. |
| 20:57 | Nachimir | James: Have always thought we should have some kind of threshold for certain things. |
| 20:58 | Nachimir | Gill: In a situation where someone's paying a penny, we're then in a position where we have to politely ask them to pay more. |
| 20:59 | Nachimir | Dominic: We'd have to set that price, and things would continually make it vary: inflation, etc. |
| 21:00 | Nachimir | Mouse: Actually against having stated mimimums, because pay what you want is a great selling point. |
| 21:00 | Nachimir | Examples/guidelines a good idea. |
| 21:00 | Nachimir | Dominic: Could use penny thing as an example on this. |
| 21:01 | Nachimir | Kate: Rather than listing as "X gets you X", have something like the cost of hacking, but more detailed. |
| 21:01 | Nachimir | Mouse: Danger though if you're going to start putting values on things, because people then think "Oh, I only have to pay this much". |
| 21:01 | Nachimir | Gareth Howell joins. |
| 21:02 | Nachimir | Action: David and Kate to work some examples out for this. No minimum membership fee. |
| 21:03 | Nachimir | Dominic: Penny a month is basically breaking the rule on "don't be a contemptible fellow". |
| 21:03 | Nachimir | AOB |
| 21:04 | You left the chat by being disconnected from the server. | |
| 21:07 | You rejoined the room. | |
| 21:08 | Nachimir | (Disconnected from IRC at 21:05) |
| 21:08 | Nachimir | Kate: I have some other business. I have somebody who can possibly start doing bike workshops again in the spring. |
| 21:08 | Nachimir | Everyone: Excellent. |
| 21:08 | Nachimir | Russell H: Gas for the welder? James H: Warren took that away but hasn't returned. Do you want to take that as an action? Russell: Will talk to Warren, I do have an interest in sorting that. |
| 21:08 | Nachimir | No other stuff, meeting adjourned. |